#WhatIKnowIs… I’m a Black British Business Awards 2021 Finalist
A lot has happened since Lindsey Stewart’s #IAM interview in July 2020. Lindsey spoke to Leanne Mair about his journey.
Having shared my career story in the summer of 2020 as part of the #IAM campaign for racial equality, I’ve since made a big career leap to be the Head of Stakeholder Engagement at the UK’s audit, accounting and corporate governance regulator, the Financial Reporting Council, and been selected as a 2021 Finalist in the Black Business Awards — one of only three finalists in the Professional Services Senior Leader category.
Huge congratulations go to Hogan Lovells partner Akima Paul Lambert for being a very worthy winner in that category — it’s been an honour just being named alongside her and David Frederick, former President of UK accounting body the AAT, as one of the leading lights in British Professional Services in our commuity.
I also spearheaded the #WhatIKnowIs campaign with CFA UK highlighting what strengths Black professionals in financial services have to offer the industry.
At the end of September — prior to the award ceremony and the start of Black History Month in the UK — I caught up with Leanne Mair who interviewed me and fellow BBBA finalist Josh Olomolaiye about our career stories and what it meant to be nominated for a major business award.
”Success is when you are no longer afraid of the truth.“
You can watch the full 45 minute video here. Below is an audio recording and edited transcript of my 25-minute conversation with Leanne. (For convenience, minute markers can be found in the transcript every five minutes or so.)
We covered the following topics.
- Growing into being a role model (2:27)
- Learning to own one’s story and success (10:29)
- What it means to be Black in the professional workplace (14:50)
- Why Black history is everyone’s history (20:57)
Transcript
This transcript of the recording has been edited for clarity.
Leanne Mair: So you already know Mr. Lindsey Stewart that I’m super happy to be interviewing you. If anyone doesn’t know, I’m a huge fan of this guy! So when I read the news that he was a finalist for the Black British Business Association Award… Yes, hold it up with pride! With pride! I couldn’t help but feel very, very proud. In the short time that I’ve come to know Lindsey he is, in many ways… And I’m thinking not because, not because I’m lost for words. I’m actually thinking ’cause I don’t know the right words to pick! He’s an amazing, amazing person, but he’s also really considered. So for me, there is nobody less deserving of being a finalist… or *more* deserving, sorry, of being a finalist and hopefully and you know… Vote! So sorry Josh, I didn’t say vote for you too. Whoops! That probably smacks of favouritism. I’m sorry, but you know!
Lindsey Stewart: There’s no vote!
Leanne Laughs.
Lindsey: There’s no vote, it’ll just happen how it happens.
Leanne: Yeah, right. So you see. There’s no vote. See that shows you how much I know about the process. But for anybody who doesn’t know, Lindsey, I’m going to ask you to introduce yourself, give us a little sneak peek behind the curtain. Who are you? What’s your category and give us a little… a little bit of intel.
Lindsey: So yeah, thank you for that glowing introduction! I’m just going to take a moment to recover from being described in such relentlessly positive tones. It doesn’t happen quite so often! Right, so yes, I’m Lindsey Stewart. I am in the Professional Services category of the Black British Business Awards. Nominated as a Senior Leader finalist… One of three. Very, very pleased with that. Current role: I am the Head of Stakeholder Engagement for the UK’s national audit, accounting and corporate governance regulator: the Financial Reporting Council. I have only been there a few weeks. Prior to that I was at KPMG, Big Four accounting and audit firm helping run an investor engagement programme, which was the culmination of a rather long career in investor relations consulting and corporate communications and technical accounting communications leading up to that. So yeah, everything seems to be landing at once at the moment.
Leanne: I think it’s fabulous. I think this is just fabulous for so many reasons. Because you know, aside from you know everyone else in this just speaking to you and Josh [Olomolaiye, fellow BBBA Finalist]. I just love to see Black excellence. And I love to see Black excellence, I said it before, being recognised by our own. That you are being recognised for your contribution to the Black community. You are a pillar of our society and in many ways the fact that you’ve been nominated as a senior member also says… I’m not gonna talk about age! Don’t even laugh. that’s not what I was gonna say!
Lindsey: But there’s a story there though! Yeah, we’ll get onto that. Let me let you finish and then we’ll get onto that bit.
“There are people out there who do things now because I do them. And that’s a lot of responsibility.”
Leanne: But no, no. We have Josh as a rising star and we have you as a senior leader which speaks to kind of cross-generational excellence, but also puts you firmly in the category of experienced role model. I know we weren’t planning on talking about that, but… Do you see that part in terms of you are a role model, myself included. You are a role model for many. How does that make you feel? How does being a finalist make you feel?
Lindsey: Being a finalist has changed the the way I see myself, the world, everyone in it. I’m going to use the clichés. I’m honoured, I’m humbled, I’m proud. I’m all of those things at the same time, right? But yeah, embracing the idea of being a role model has been a journey because… Let’s say in the UK, in in the US, in Canada, in countries where people like us are ‘Black’, where we are visibly different from everyone else, no one is the same person that they were five years ago. I guarantee you that! Not one person is the same person they were.
Leanne: And if they are, I feel sorry for them.
Lindsey: For real! So, the Lindsey of 2013, ’14, ’15, ’16 would be truly mortified and embarrassed at some of the things that the Lindsey of 2021 is doing! Turning up on videos. Standing up in front of audiences. There were times when I would have to stand up in front of an audience and my colleagues would be like ‘Lindsey, are you OK?’ because I was so visibly disturbed by the experience of being in front of them and being the centre of attention. So yeah, that’s been a journey! And now it’s like just accepting the fact that the progression that I’ve been fortunate enough to enjoy — and there’s been a lot of fortune in there. There’s been a lot of hard work! But there’s been a lot of fortune in there too, and those are things I’ve explored in other conversations which you can Google.
[5:06]
But there are people out there who do things now because I do them. And that’s a lot of responsibility. It’s like I’ve got to think ‘What is the message that I want to send if I do this?’ Who’s watching? Who’s taking what Lindsey does and thinking ‘Well, Lindsey kind of got where he is; maybe I should do this too.’ It’s like, there’s a lot of responsibility there and it’s something that I take very seriously.
Leanne: And I think that’s the difference sometimes. We all have the capacity in some way, shape or form to be a role model for somebody. But part of embracing it is acknowledging that there is a responsibility. And sometimes the responsibility is in as much as how you behave, but also in as much as how much you give back. And I think one of the things — and this may have mortified the Lindsey of yore — but one of the things you’re amazing at doing is being very generous with your story. Being very generous with your journey. And now, in this conversation you’ve obviously spoken about what you do, and we’ve also had conversations about your journey in and of itself, but sharing that and also kind of sharing the experiences as you the man, but also as you the Black man, does make a huge difference to changing the narrative but also emboldening the next generation. Potentially — I don’t know if this is true, but this is just me saying it in, like, a romanticised version. Potentially Josh could have seen you at one point down the hall and been like ‘I don’t know what he does, but there’s another one of me.’
Lindsey: You know what’s funny about that is that Josh and I have actually never met!
Leanne: That’s hilarious!
Lindsey: Yeah, I feel like I’m known him all my life because we were both at KPMG and during the middle of lockdown, and post-George Floyd and all that, we were kind of on the same groups, just working out ‘Okay, what are we going to do about this?’
Leanne: Right, right!
Lindsey: And so, I feel like I’ve known Josh my whole life. But we’ve actually never met, so there has never been that meeting in the hallway. I hope there is one day.
Leanne: There has to be! Even if I have to orchestrate it myself and finally come to London. I know this is slightly off kilter in terms of the pandemic. But I think the pandemic has done a lot for Black people who were already on a journey. We have refined and articulated our values and our identity, and also coming into contact and having conversations with other Black people who are like-minded. And I think that’s something super special and I think you’ve done an amazing job of curating and and bringing together people as well. And I think that’s all part and parcel of being a role model, Lindsey.
Leanne: Thank you, Leanne. That point about owning one’s own story is massively important because… I feel like I picked this phrase up from somewhere, but for the life of me I cannot remember where! So if you’re the person who originated this phrase, please do get in contact and let me know so I can attribute it!
Lindsey: It was probably me!
Leanne: However, the phrase that’s in my head is: ‘Success is when you are no longer afraid of the truth.’
Lindsey: Love that.
Leanne: ‘When you are no longer afraid of the truth.’ And there’s times in my life where it’s like… I’ve talked my career story before, I was never particularly proud of having to work at McDonald’s with all the brains that I knew I had, as important as those experiences were back then. And then you know, not going to university. Trying to build a career being somebody who went to a non-selective state school and hasn’t been to university and all of that. And quite a lot of it was for a long time: ‘Nobody must know! No-one must know!
‘Success is when you’re no longer afraid of the truth.’ Yes, I did work at McDonald’s! Yes, I did go to a non-selective state school! Yes, I did pass my accountancy exams; eventually, despite a few setbacks. Yes I did pass the CFA exam! Yes I did set up an investor engagement programme for a big four accounting firm! Yes, I am the Head of Stakeholder Engagement at a national regulator! That’s me. Success is when you’re no longer afraid of your own truth.
Leanne: Own it, own it! And the reason why you have to own it is. You’re owning it for that young boy who was Lindsey who didn’t own it. But you’re owning it for those who still believe that university is the only way. You’re owning it for companies who still believe that they have to hire from particular universities. You’re owning it for anybody who says ‘I daren’t try something different.’ And you’re saying to the Black community: ‘Guys! We have talents!’ I’ve been to university — whatever! But university doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of life. It’s an experience. It’s not necessarily an education. Unless you’re a doctor or a dentist or something like that. It’s an experience not an education, and that’s what people forget.
[09:53]
You have… And I’m not even gonna say ‘You have overcome,’ like that. I mean you have decided ‘I can do this.’ And I think that level of resilience, that level of talent — It’s not a coincidence. Yes, there’s been fortune, but it’s not a coincidence that you’ve landed where you’ve landed, and I think part of accepting your success is understanding that. You didn’t get to today because you were lucky. You got today because you worked hard. You have to remember that bit too. Yes, a little bit of luck. But what do they say? People make their own luck anyway.
Leanne: I love that! And so, the ‘Senior Leader’ bit. Why the Senior Leader category? Because I’m not going to lie, I was not put forward for this! At least not to my knowledge. If I was put forward for it then get in contact and let me know! But I haven’t heard that I have, right?
I applied for this myself, because the Black British Business Awards is one where you can tell your story and apply to be considered. So that is what I did, because quite a lot of what I do as like an investor and stakeholder engagement expert is one-to-one, behind the scenes — not necessarily something that is visible from the outside. However, it’s massively important. And I’d managed to get to a point, from starting as a school leaver, where I was having frequent, regular conversations with the world’s leading investors. Bar none. The world’s leading investors. Saying: ‘Yeah, could you come have a word with us about this? So, I heard what you said at this conference. I would love to explore that with you. Have a conversation with me.’ And I was succeeding in doing it, and that story needed to be told. I got to a point where I was lecturing at leading universities in the middle of lockdown. I’d written things for the Harvard Law School Forum. And I’m like: ‘Well that’s not nothing, is it?’
Leanne: Really?! Really, it’s not nothing? I didn’t know! I just really thought that everybody did that! (Laughs.)
Lindsey: Yeah, so I was going to apply and I was determined to apply in the Rising Star category. Because like I felt, you know: ‘I’ve got into the Big Four. I’ve had a bit of a career reset after my firm got acquired. Apply in the Rising Star category.’
Leanne: Okay, I’m not trying to be rude, Lindsey. Before you continue this story. But you and I are a similar age group, right? So that means we have a minimum of 15 years’ work experience. What ‘rising star’ are we meant to be at this age?
Lindsey: Again, that’s that’s the journey isn’t? It’s like, learning… Learning where you’re at. So, I was going to apply in the Rising Star. Now, it turns out that the Black British Business Awards has a hard limit on the Rising Star category of 35 years, which I have exceeded by five years!
Leanne laughs.
Lindsey: So, I’m like. What’s important here is that I didn’t say: ‘Oh well, that’s it. I’m not gonna do it.’ I’m like: ‘Well. Senior Leader category it is then!’ So, same application went in the Senior Leader category and then applications and then judging day and just continuing to tell my story and then got the nomination and I have a shiny glass trophy on my desk. It’s nice!
Leanne: The shiny glass trophy. I’m happy for you. I’m just trying to understand what in the name of delusion made you think you were gonna be a rising star? So… (Clears throat.)
Lindsey: Plus I would have pushed Josh out, I now discover. So that wouldn’t have been good either, would it?
Leanne: Listen, listen! Don’t try and get Josh into any of this! Mister Of-course-I’m-a-Rising-Star. What I will let you off in saying, maybe the point at which you decided to embrace and own your Lindsey story was a lot shorter than the duration of your career, which made you feel as though you were a rising star and that was the reason why you did it.
Lindsey: Yeah, that that’s all mixed in there for sure.
Leanne: That’s what I’m going to go for. That’s what I’m going for. Senior Leader, I like it. You are a senior leader. I mean you’re the Head of Stakeholder Engagement somewhere. You’re a senior leader, my friend.
Lindsey: And I’m owning that now. Like you know there are things I’m turning down because they’re not ‘bossy’ enough, right? And I’m trying to rehabilitate the word ‘bossy’. You use ‘bossy’ as an insult — I say like you can just flip it around saying like: ‘That’s not bossy enough. That isn’t something I need to get involved in.’
Leanne: I think ‘bossy’ is a fantastic word and I am bossy — surprise surprise — and it’s a great word! So I think, you know you’ve done a good job. I can’t imagine you being bossy, but that’s like a completely different topic. I can’t imagine you being bossy at all. I can just imagine you being like really nice to work with. If anyone had any stories to the contrary, please feel free to give me the tea! I’m ready to listen.
So, I asked Josh this question as well: In terms of Blackness, how has your Blackness impacted your career or how do you feel it has impacted your career? If at all? Do you feel like you’ve had to change, assimilate, adapt, or do you feel like you were always able to be you? Was it the environment, was it yourself that made any difference?
[15:11]
Lindsey: Oh, that’s an interesting question. Here’s the thing, I don’t know if being Black has impacted my career because like nobody really knows what decisions are made behind closed doors that might have changed the trajectory. I’m grateful for the path that I’ve got and I’ve not been the victim of overt racism in in the workplace. The occasional micro-aggression? Sure, yeah. But I feel like I’ve spent quite a lot of my time trying to establish common ground with pretty much everyone that I work with, right? Just trying to basically understand what they’re about and demonstrate that, you know, I’m different to them, but I’m not that different!
Leanne: Right
Lindsey: And also to kind of establish that I’m here to deploy my knowledge and my personality, and not necessarily my back story or whatever it is that goes into that. I’ve spoken on video about seeking opportunities to make twice the difference, and I feel like that’s kind of been out in front ahead of my Blackness. And I think only kind of more recently, am I thinking: ‘Do you know what? The part of you that is, like, a Black man from Dagenham from what is called a ‘lower’ socio-economic background. (I will never agree with those terms but that’s another TED Talk!) That’s important to a lot of people. And so, I’m kind of trying now to be out there and say: ‘OK, yes. Yes, social mobility. Yes, let’s include Black people. Let’s not just throw a blanket over everybody who isn’t White and think that the same approach will work for everyone.’
Leanne: Right.
Lindsey: It is important once you kind of get to the level that I’m at that you have those conversations and that you’re candid about them and that you’re kind of not afraid to ruffle some feathers. Because, not all of this is supposed to be sunshine and parties and rainbows. Some of it is meant to be deeply uncomfortable.
Leanne: 100% it really is. I’m not sure if you and I talked about this before but I think the most important or the really important part of what you said there is also a lot of successful Black people don’t like to talk about racism because they still believe racism is somehow a poor Black person’s problem. Or don’t like to talk about Blackness, because talking about your Blackness highlights that you’re Black and if you spend most of your time trying to blend in, especially at a more senior level, then it’s uncomfortable. Or if you refer to yourself from coming from a non-privileged background, it makes other people feel uncomfortable.
But the reality is, it’s that every part of your story, irrespective of what it is — it doesn’t have to be the Black component — speaks to somebody out there, says to somebody ‘this is a possibility,’ says to somebody that if I just make twice the difference, not work twice as hard, I can be — hopefully — close to where Lindsey is. I can do something similar. The question is just applying myself.
See, I mean the one thing you have spoken about, and I think it’s something that you don’t say enough, is being proactive about making a choice. Once you decide to make a choice you’re very proactive about taking action, and I think that’s something that — especially since we’re talking about this within the Black context — I think this is something, a message that’s really important, that we can’t wait for others to give us permission. We can’t wait for others to try and come and save us. We have to be proactive about making those decisions. And I think you embody that really, really well.
Lindsey: Thanks Leanne. Yeah, that’s one of those kind of slightly uncomfortable conversations that you often have to have. It’s like sometimes I’ll just challenge people to think… You know, other Black people. That if I were to snap my fingers and suddenly the world was fair, What would you do in that world?
Leanne: Who would you be?
Lindsey: Because no magic is going to happen. You’re not just going to suddenly be the director or CEO of a company just because the world is suddenly fair, right? What are you going to do?
Leanne: Right.
Lindsey: I feel like from a lot of quarters… Not all. But many. Enough to count. There’s a lot of: ‘They need to do X and Y and Z, and so on.’ Well, of course they do. Yeah, I agree with that 100%.
Leanne: Granted!
Lindsey: What are you going to do?
[19:47]
Leanne: Right. And I think this is why this conversation is so important. I can’t speak to any of the other finalists. And you know, if any of them aren’t in the same calibre as you and Josh, then I have a problem! But I don’t think that It’s just about you know you being nominated or being finalists. It’s not just about what you do, but it’s also about who you are, and I think your ability to articulate this in a way that you say: ‘Guys — everybody guys and girls, you need to do for yourself rather than just expecting people to do for you.’
And I’m sure Josh could relate some stories of his own to show that he’s also been proactive, but I’m sure for every success story, the theme is the same. Success doesn’t happen on its own. You don’t get to this place by simply wishing for it, you have to do something for it. You and I have had different conversations, but that’s what for me is one of the most inspiring parts is that you go and do. It’s not just talk, talk, talk — you go and do.
And thinking about that and thinking about upcoming Black History Month, how do you want Black History Month to be celebrated? What do you hope for? And as I said to Josh for Black and non-Black people, what do you want them to take away from this month.
Lindsey: Yeah, great question. I got pretty deeply involved with Black History Month ’cause I was running communications for the the employee network where I previously was. And we kind of settled on this idea that: Black history is history. Okay? We look at a particular aspect of it for for a month, but hang on a minute: Black history is history. It isn’t just for us, it’s for everyone to know.
Leanne: Correct.
Lindsey: And in that context, there’s this pairing up. It’s like you look at the past, you see what happens, you acknowledge what went wrong. You acknowledge the the strength and the benefit that even came out of those things, and you look toward the future and you ask yourself that same question: ‘What are what are we going to do?’ Next year, year after, year after that, and so on? So that’s kind of what I want everyone to kind of takeaway from that in the in the next month that’s coming up. It’s like what are what are we all going to do with with this knowledge? Let’s celebrate a bit, of course, because like there’s not enough opportunity for us to celebrate Black excellence. So, we’ve got a month. Let’s make the best of it. But what are we all going to do next? There’s a lot of people who made pledges and statements and held up cards and said ‘I am’. And, okay great. What have you done in the year since then? What are you going to do now?
Leanne: Right? I forgot that was on video ’cause I think I cut my eye, or might have rolled them when you…
Lindsey laughs.
Leanne: Listen I forget sometimes. You make me forget that there’s a camera and then I start doing all these facial expressions and it’s like ‘Okay, there’s… there’s the real story!’
No, but you’re right, it’s… it’s about making it ‘more than…’. And Black history is history full stop, but the point is that people have to get over the shame of what happened in this construct of colonisation and all this stuff to be able to integrate it. When it comes to colonisation, there’s definitely that part that people can’t reconcile this part of having ‘good versus evil’, as opposed to: ‘This is fact, it’s not fiction, so let’s talk about it. Let’s include it in our normal history topics because it’s relevant.’ But by refusing to acknowledge what happened, you force us to push you to confront the reality of what actually did happen, and as you said this is part of British history. The things we talk about is heavily ingrained not only into British history, but also into the British economy.
Lindsey: Yeah.
Leanne: You can’t, you can’t ignore it. When people who sit on 300 million, they’re worth 300 million because they inherited a sugar plantation in Barbados. It’s ever present what happened before, so we have to focus on our present. We also have to focus on how we plan to build this future — ‘Build it back better’ or something like that. How do we build back better for Black people? That should be our focus. History, we need to know where we came from because without history we don’t understand everything. But we have to kind of look forward too. And I fully expect to see you at some helm of something because you’re just awesome! So that’s my last word!
Lindsey: Thank you have plans in that area. I have plans.
